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Oct 29th 2007

You know what another funny part from the commercial is? When Dwight reveals himself to Phyllis.

  1. It's presented as bad news.
  2. You don't need to tell a woman that she has a son out there. She knows.

I don't think Jim's behavior was jerky at all. He was stepping in to interrupt Pam like he has done their entire tenure at DM. This time, Pam was interested in a project that he shut off. We feel angry because Pam liked what she was working on, not because Jim interrupted it. Pam could be a closet workaholic who has never had work to holic on, though. The future could have her becoming less amused by interruptions. I didn't get insecure from Jim at all. Not even with his embarrassment about the Second Life interrogation. That was just vulnerability.

Oct 29th 2007 edited

I don't think Jim's behavior was jerky at all. He was stepping in to interrupt Pam like he has done their entire tenure at DM. This time, Pam was interested in a project that he shut off. We feel angry because Pam liked what she was working on, not because Jim interrupted it. Pam could be a closet workaholic who has never had work to holic on, though. The future could have her becoming less amused by interruptions. I didn't get insecure from Jim at all. Not even with his embarrassment about the Second Life interrogation. That was just vulnerability.

Yeah, what KarenX said - perfectly :)

Oct 29th 2007

We feel angry because Pam liked what she was working on, not because Jim interrupted it.

I interpreted it as something she was unhealthily obsessed with, and that Jim felt she might have been working too hard on a Michael Scott pipe dream... which, she was.

Oct 29th 2007

I interpreted it as something she was unhealthily obsessed with

Seriously? I interpreted as the exact opposite of that: Something cool that she was passionate about. When Jim shut it off, I felt it was a little presumtuous. Yes, he's interrupted her in the past, but he knows she likes that stuff, and he knew she was doing it.

Oct 29th 2007

I interpreted as the exact opposite of that: Something cool that she was passionate about.

Yes, me too. I still think Jim was a little jerky there, albeit unknowingly, and he'll know better next time.

Oct 29th 2007

I think under a lot of circumstances Jim's interruption would have been jerky, but since he was doing it out of concern for Dwight, he was forgiven.

Oct 29th 2007

I would never have imagined such a divided camp over the issue of Jim being jerky or not interupting Pam's animation. I don't think her reaction was of annoyance, so I'm going to have to join the not-jerky side of the debate. He didn't state that what she was doing was pointless (although he did note that nobody would see it, but I agree with an earlier post that it was a jab a Michael and not her) and plus their history of stopping what they are doing to concentrate on something Dwight-related just points this issue in the not-jerky direction for me. There's no right or wrong here, plus it gave Pam a chance to poke some fun at Jim which was cute on her part.

Oct 29th 2007

He didn't state that what she was doing was pointless

But he behaved as if it was.

Oct 29th 2007

But he behaved as if it was.

Yeah, but that's only because it really was.

Roy would do those things even when it wasn't pointless. In this case, Jim was 100% right. It was something for a harebrained Michael Scott Joint ("GREAT SCOTT!"), and it was a huge waste of her time and talent.

Oct 29th 2007

I interpreted as the exact opposite of that: Something cool that she was passionate about.

Yes, me too. I still think Jim was a little jerky there, albeit unknowingly, and he'll know better next time.

This is correct. Please adjust all contrary opinions accordingly.

Oct 29th 2007

Roy would do those things even when it wasn't pointless. In this case, Jim was 100% right. It was something for a harebrained Michael Scott Joint ("GREAT SCOTT!"), and it was a huge waste of her time and talent.

I'll disagree with DFTF in the sense that it was not done with maliscious intent. He was just excited to share something with Pam. His daily tasks are so mundane, he will look for any reason to go share some time with Pam. But I will agree in the sense that it was not a waste of time in regards to Tiny Dundie's post. Learning a new skill art related would never be seen as a waste of time. Having a wife that some day after raising kids wants to be a graphic artist, spent countless hours working on projects that were never even seen by her college instructors, and I would fear for my life calling that a waste of her time and talent.

Oct 29th 2007

Let's be honest, call of duty - there's a big difference between your wife's situation and Pam doing something for a MICHAEL SCOTT scheme.

The point of this can be found in the words that I put in all caps. That's why Jim thought it was a waste of Pam's time and talent.

Oct 29th 2007

I'll disagree with DFTF in the sense that it was not done with maliscious intent.

Of course it wasn't. It was just a little careless is all.

Oct 29th 2007 edited

Let's be honest, call of duty - there's a big difference between your wife's situation and Pam doing something for a MICHAEL SCOTT scheme.

  1. She was finally enjoying her work, and that's something, whether Michael's an idiot or not.

  2. It's good practice, and something she could put on a resumé someday.

In other words, so what if it's Michael's crazy idea?

edit: Also, I DARE you to behave as if what a woman doing is stupid, even if it is. I dare you.

Oct 29th 2007

It couldn't be a waste of her time and talent if it was practice. And Jim was just doing what he always did. He couldn't have foreseen that a five-second interruption might or might not have upset Pam. And plus, she worked on it for like 16 hours. His interruption maybe would have gotten her home by 2:15am instead of falling asleep at 2:30.

Oct 29th 2007

Why's it so hard to accept that Jim was being a little jerky there? He didn't punch her in the face or sleep with her dad. He just interrupted her when he probably should have realized she wasn't checking 59 voicemails but rather working on a creative project she'd announced her interest in to the entire staff during the conference room scene. He was jerky to her when he said he'd never leave her at a minor league hockey game and when he ratted out her wedding planning to Toby. So there's precedent for minor jerkiness and precedent for his recovering from it. I am convinced this is the seed of discord that will become significant in the next several weeks.

Oct 29th 2007

What Brian said. We have to remember that Jim & Pam are not binary: They are not either gloriously blissful or having a break-up. This is the sort of thing I was hoping they would make a storyline out of -- the minor bumps involved in a serious relationship, rather than big fakey drama like most shows would do (and this one did last season).

Oct 29th 2007

In other words, so what if it's Michael's crazy idea?

Given that with the exception of one moment, Michael pretty much marginalizes Pam and her talents... I'd say Jim has every reason to think that her hard work could be a waste of time.

Oct 29th 2007 edited

I'd say Jim has every reason to think that her hard work could be a waste of time.

But Pam didn't, which is the important part.

Look, I don't think Jim was acting like a huge asshole, or anything. But given that she was working on art project, I think it's not completely unfair to expect him to ask before commandeering her computer. It's an infraction on a scale even lower than the examples Brian cited above, but still slightly inconsiderate.

Oct 29th 2007

He was jerky to her when he said he'd never leave her at a minor league hockey game and when he ratted out her wedding planning to Toby. So there's precedent for minor jerkiness and precedent for his recovering from it.

Another way to look at it is Jim being honest about how Roy treated Pam... and that her constantly planning her wedding around Jim was a little callous to him, and so he used a legitimate means to vent his frustration (which was later redacted, mind you, once he cooled off).

Oct 29th 2007

her hard work could be a waste of time.

Like others said, it's not a waste of time, it was a way to practice a skill she is really interested in and wants to use in a professional setting someday. And I second what DftF said about what Brian originally said.

Oct 29th 2007

He was totally venting in each of those instances. Justifiably, maybe, but neither instance was for her benefit. And yes, they were worse than pushing aside her graphics work. That just makes it easier to accept that he was being a bit insensitive. Of course he didn't know how important it was to her. If he did, he would have acknowledged that and either come back later or asked her politely if he could interrupt.

Oct 29th 2007

edit: Also, I DARE you to behave as if what a woman doing is stupid, even if it is. I dare you.

Double dog dare even.

Why's it so hard to accept that Jim was being a little jerky there?

Not seeing it as a matter of acceptance. Couldn't agree more that he was acting jerky with the two instances you bring up. As he stated himself, "he's not perfect" from Launch Party. Perhaps the issue is being ran into the ground. Now I can agree that it was deliberately played out that way as the beginning of their journey to working out the issues that every relationship encounters, up and downs of good and bad times.

Now Isn't there something else to we can analyze - perhaps why the paper airplane didn't collide into Toby's dome? What type of bike did the waiter at Poor Richards have? Any other thoughts?

Oct 29th 2007

I don't think Jim was being jerky. Those other instances Brian mentioned were jerky to me but not this one, at least not to me. I think LT said best before when she said:

Even when he switched her screen, it didn't seem like he was being dismissive about her work or making her feel guilty for spending time on it or acting like it wasn't important or deleting her animation or pouting because she wasn't spending time with him. I just took it as him wanting to get his forever co-conspirator, Pam, in on the Second Life thing with Dwight, and he was excited to show her the game. It didn't seem like a big deal to me.

Oct 29th 2007

Has it been noted that when Dwight and Phyllis have their scene in the ad, Dwight looks proudly at Angela who half-smiles and looks down in most adorable fashion? I don't think Andy stands a chance with her.

Oct 29th 2007

I agree with what KarenX said:

I don't think Jim's behavior was jerky at all. He was stepping in to interrupt Pam like he has done their entire tenure at DM. This time, Pam was interested in a project that he shut off.

And what PamCasso said:

And Jim was just doing what he always did. He couldn't have foreseen that a five-second interruption might or might not have upset Pam.

Exactly. He can't analyze everything he does from the perspective of, "I've always done this in the past and it's been well-received, but if I do it now can I expect the same reaction from Pam or are the circumstances different?" I'd be exhausted on his behalf. Minimizing her screen was a split-second decision, meant to entertain and to express concern for Dwight. I don't think it was indicative of insensitivity or the fact that he doesn't support her art. Plus, even though it was art-related, it was still Dunder Mifflin related, and they've always been united on the "everything do to with this place kinda sucks" front.

Not jerky.

Oct 29th 2007

I have a question about Angela so this should probably go in the Angela thread but I'm here now, so whatevs. Why do you think Angela is ok with going out with Andy and having everyone know about it? Is it just to shove it in Dwight's face? I mean, she was with Dwight for two years or so and she was so adamant about never letting anyone know. She could have found a way to go out with Andy without the rest of the office knowing and still let Dwight know about it.

Oct 29th 2007

Not jerky.

Besides, Pam wasn't mad. She was astonished, and then amused, and then touched. But if it happens again and again, just when she's getting interested in her job... I was just proposing this scenario as a possible source of relationship conflict.

Oct 29th 2007

Has it been noted that when Dwight and Phyllis have their scene in the ad, Dwight looks proudly at Angela who half-smiles and looks down in most adorable fashion? I don't think Andy stands a chance with her.

Agreed. Dwight will win her back with a little help from Jim and Pam. I'm thinking around the Christmas episode.

Oct 29th 2007

Besides, Pam wasn't mad. She was astonished, and then amused, and then touched.

She seemed irritated at first, at least to me.

I'm not saying that Jim should analyze the situation differently now that the circumstances of their relationship have changed. I'm saying that he knew she was working on a project that she volunteered for, and maybe he should have said, "Can I show you something? It's really good, and it'll take like two minutes," before just taking over the computer.

Speaking of the ad, isn't it distinctly possible that Dwight is in fact older than Phyllis?

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